Author Topic: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus  (Read 1002 times)

Offline rajaty

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« on: September 11, 2016, 01:16:39 AM »
I started vision improvement around 3 months back and accidentally landed on this forum. I read research papers and figure that "reversing axial length" was key to vision improvement. Several research papers had tried plus on animal models with successful results so I was looking for people who had done that. This forum gave me some hope notably from warren, steven and ofcourse Otis.

I was intrigued by Stevens idea of wearing high plus and hocus pocus idea of  looking far away. I decided to combine both I started using +5 to look at clouds for 1-2 hours everyday.

My starting prescription  was-
1) right eye- -2 sph -1.75 cyl
2) left eye      -2 sph  -0.75 cyl

After 30 days I got my eye check again
1)right eye -1.75 sph -0.75 cyl
2) left eye  -1.75 sph  -0.25  cyl

My astigmatism had dropped super fast

Along with this I also started wearing +1 lenses in office all the time. I could slouch a little and do most of my work.

After 30 days more, a month later
1)right eye -1.75 sph -0.5 cyl
2) left eye  -1.5 sph  -0.25  cyl

I was happy with the progress of taking -.25 reductions every month.

BUT this is where I got greedy and went for HIGHER PLUS, I wore a +3 over +5 and started using that. There is no doubt it causes immediate improvement with in 3-5 days, but I ended up with 1 decent size floater in each of the eye.

Does any one know why this may have happened?
I panicked and stopped wearing any high plus, only use +1 for indoors and -1 for night vision. These floaters have given me a little anxiety because I read a lot and couldn't find any place where they said that they go away.

I got my retina checked and it is fine and doctor couldn't even spot floaters in my eye, I am little scared to use plus now because of these floaters. I know I had floaters earlier too, but they were never this prominent.

When the eye contracts again using plus how does the viterous humour change itself? is a key key question for floater development and may be if you use very strong plus very soon it may do something to viterous humour.

I am very keen to start using plus again but want to give my floaters 5-6 weeks to see if they go away, or were they for any other reason.

Cheers

Offline OtisBrown

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1734
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2016, 07:24:12 PM »
Hi  Rajaty,

FLOATERS:  I have them.  Got them a long time ago.  I was not wearing a plus at that time.  Typically they "fade" with time.

I personally wear a plus for all close work.  There is no reason to "fear" the plus.  Equally, there is no reason to wear a strong plus
lens - at all.

The plus does not "cure".  It simply gets "rid of" that near environment.

If all of this concerns you - then do some more research - until you are satisfied that long-term plus wear is right for you.

Offline rajaty

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2016, 08:13:06 PM »
Thanks...

Yup, I think i ll go away from high plus route and just stick to wearing plus all the time inside my office (+1+2).

Well i read "somewhere" that if you change your lens power dramatically it can cause floaters, i don't know of any mechanism that would do it. No such studies.

Why are people with high myopia at risk of vitreous detachment? Is it due to lens or something in eye itself? Any onw knows this?

Cheers
Rajat


Offline OtisBrown

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1734
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2016, 04:31:17 AM »
Hi Rajaty -
The higher the myopia, the more probable a retina detachment - and blindness.
This was a study conducted by Dr. Perkins. 
I was under that threat - and perhaps I still am.
The REASON I became interested in "just prevention", was for that problem.  If you start with "plus prevention", and
always "exceed" the 20/30 line, you never get into nearsightedness - in the first place.

SUBJECT: PLUS LENS FOR NEAR.

For most people they have two distances.  Computer at 24 inches, and books, at about 16 inches.

For me, I use a +3 D for near work, and about a +2.0 for the computer.

Since you are at about  -1.25 D,  you could use a +2 for reading, and a +1 for your computer.

When I say -1.25, I mean that you can read in the range of 20/30 to 20/25 with a -1.25 lens.

But please - sent a reasonable objective goal for yourself - to, with naked eyes - read the 20/40 line or better.

People who DEMAND 20/18 VISION simply should quit - before they start with this process. 

Accepting a reasonable goal - and long-term plus wearing - is the only way that I think a degree of success
can be achieved.

Enjoy,

Offline rajaty

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2016, 06:34:29 AM »
Thanks Otis,


yes, I am little more aggressive, i use +2 for my 6 hours of office work indoors daily. I usually slouch a little but that is ok. I get that you ask me to aim for only 20/40 but my aim is 20/25, it will take time but that is ok.


two other points-

1) Floaters- I think i may have figured what may have caused it, I was doing excessive eye stretches in all possible direction. When my eye doc said don't pull weights/strain muscles is when i understood I had been doing that with my eye. I'll give it few weeks and reports how it settles down.

2) Astigmatism -Astigmatism is basically badly shaped cornea/lens? right. When u look far away your lens flattens, so if you look in the sky wearing a plus, there will be a lot of flattening force on your lens. I think this puts back everything in shape and astigmatism drop. That is my theory and something that worked for me.


Cheers
Rajat

Offline j23

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2016, 02:45:48 AM »
Hi rajaty

Aren't you posing too much shock to your eyes, everywhere they advise 'slow steady' progress (not only for safety reasons, eye needs to rebuild and it is not overnight I guess, until it is rebuilt the only force that gives them shape change are muscles). Correct me if you think otherwise.

The stimuli cannot be too little nor to much.

To compare with swimming - you know - you can learn swimming by jumping to deep water, but this may be the last time ever :( - because you have to precausions for random issues you nor me are not aware of.

I also feel I am starting too offensive (3 weeks now,
1st week +1D for PC,
next +1,5D at over 50cm distance,
today at the end of 3rd week +2D - but I cannot avoid leaning forward to 40cm to see clearly, I am just testing how it works today, but keeping distance around 50cm is hard - yes I know the math that +2D in my case is like looking at horizon with healthy 0.0 eyes) . So maybe it is better to keep weak glassed but look from more distance ?

My weaker eye when sets up correctly can see equally good as better one (weaker have -0.75 astigmatizm)

I do not have time for any exercises nor print pushing, but I am just using PLUS for computer work up to 8 h a day.

Do you feel any muscles tension in and around your eye ? Or the problem was the floater ?

regards
j23

« Last Edit: October 28, 2016, 03:20:23 AM by j23 »

Offline OtisBrown

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1734
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #6 on: October 31, 2016, 07:11:02 AM »
Hi rajaty

Aren't you posing too much shock to your eyes, everywhere they advise 'slow steady' progress (not only for safety reasons, eye needs to rebuild and it is not overnight I guess, until it is rebuilt the only force that gives them shape change are muscles). Correct me if you think otherwise.

The stimuli cannot be too little nor to much.

To compare with swimming - you know - you can learn swimming by jumping to deep water, but this may be the last time ever :( - because you have to precausions for random issues you nor me are not aware of.

I also feel I am starting too offensive (3 weeks now,
1st week +1D for PC,
next +1,5D at over 50cm distance,
today at the end of 3rd week +2D - but I cannot avoid leaning forward to 40cm to see clearly, I am just testing how it works today, but keeping distance around 50cm is hard - yes I know the math that +2D in my case is like looking at horizon with healthy 0.0 eyes) . So maybe it is better to keep weak glassed but look from more distance ?

My weaker eye when sets up correctly can see equally good as better one (weaker have -0.75 astigmatizm)

I do not have time for any exercises nor print pushing, but I am just using PLUS for computer work up to 8 h a day.

Do you feel any muscles tension in and around your eye ? Or the problem was the floater ?

regards
j23

SUBJECT:  The mistakes - everyone makes.

1) They do not set up a Snellen, in home, at 20 feet and look at it on  a regular basis.
2) They do not set up a reasonable OBJECTIVE GOAL, that they must measure themselves.
3) They rely on an OD - in his office - who believes that ALL PREVENTION IS PURE BULL SHIT.
4) That ALWAYS CREATES A BAD MEASUREMENT - AND THE ISSUE IS INDEED TRUST.
5) I personally agree - that to "see" any results, takes from six to nine months.
6) Science shows the eye changes at a rate of about +3/4 diopters per year.

YOU SPECIFIC COMMENTARY ON WHY I SAID 20/40 - AS A GOAL.

If you demand 20/15 and 20/13 - you will fail totally.
If you demand OD "certification- you will fail.

The real difficult isssue - is that any success - means long-term plus wearing.  There is no alternative.
(See scientific data - if you wish to ask WHY, long -term wearing is necessary.

20/40 PASSES THE REQUIRED DMV TEST.  But once you "get there", that does not mean  you quit.

Rather, it is the "marker" to judge future, objective success. 

I would gladly go though life, always wearing the plus, and always objectively passing the 20/40 line - and it
does require long-term plus wearing.

That is the real challenge - you must face.

Offline j23

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #7 on: October 31, 2016, 08:36:46 AM »
I did not use Snellen since the day one for one reason - to get a reasonable BASELINE
I know that much computer work could keep my eye too stressed, so before start I wanted to pass some warm up.

My goal is :
1. to check on myself if the method really works - reversing the direction of change (withut any mid term side effects on me - for long term of course I have to wait longer) ,
    until I will ask e.g. my child to do it
2. to check on myself if this is persistent enough (E.g. if I stop looking through PLUS for a week , how much gain will be lost), if the rate of loosing the sight is slow then it is worth a while.
3. as a side effect - to release accomodation - as recently I felt my eyes were really tense when it comes to accomodation

for the Snellen I would like see any improvement in reverse direction from my 'warm-up' baseline
« Last Edit: November 03, 2016, 12:52:55 AM by j23 »

Offline rajaty

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2016, 10:16:42 PM »
I was indeed shocking my eye using high plus, but I do not thinking wearing low plus for near work shocks your eyes, I feel no muscle tension using +1,+2.

Offline foie

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2016, 12:18:51 AM »
Hello Rajaty ! great post !! I think you re right with shocking your eyes with strong plus lens !!! I bought +8 and +5 lens to train my eyes . How many minutes by day you wore your +5 to have improvements ? Did you watch the horizon or a snellen chart or a text near your face ?

Thanks a lot for your answer !!!

Offline j23

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2016, 01:00:06 AM »
Hello Rajaty ! great post !! I think you re right with shocking your eyes with strong plus lens !!! I bought +8 and +5 lens to train my eyes . How many minutes by day you wore your +5 to have improvements ? Did you watch the horizon or a snellen chart or a text near your face ?

Thanks a lot for your answer !!!

I think that Rajaty realized the risk and is not that eager to continue on such experiment.
I can see that you started nearly year ago and disappointed with results ?

Would you be so kind to respond to a few questions below:

  • Have you tried relaxing (palming the eyes) before exercises ?
  • Can you feel anything like occular muscles wear or pressure (after exercises) - which could mean that muscles tried to re-adjust the eye.
  • When blinking, staring - nothing improves (the eye does not try to stretch to see better) ?
  • After wearing plus when reading for a while (30-60 minutes) - when you take it off - do you feel a temporary (e.g. 30 minutes) improvement ?
  • Do you feel any pain inside the eye (some strain) when looking or exercising ?
  • Have you tried to train 1 eye at a time ?

thx
« Last Edit: January 13, 2017, 03:05:23 AM by j23 »

Offline foie

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #11 on: December 19, 2016, 03:52:28 AM »
Hello j23! I try to answer you:
- i don t relax my eyes before exercices
-no occular pressure
-when blinkink staring or wear plus lens short improvement for only 15 mn
-no pain inside eye and no train one eye after the other. Is it important ? 
Do you see great improvement with your suggestions. 
What risks with high plus lens,?  Steven succes with this method...  Thanks

Offline j23

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 13
Re: My reductions + Floaters + hocus Focus+ High Plus
« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2016, 02:28:13 PM »
Hello j23! I try to answer you:
- i don t relax my eyes before exercices
-no occular pressure
-when blinkink staring or wear plus lens short improvement for only 15 mn
-no pain inside eye and no train one eye after the other. Is it important ? 
Do you see great improvement with your suggestions. 
What risks with high plus lens,?  Steven succes with this method...  Thanks

I am a newbie. So the improvement is very limited (I mean the improvement to have a stable better vision).

From personal experience - after the first month of using I got nearly red sore eyes and it took another month to recover
now on very first sign of uneasiness I stop for a while to get some rest.
 (of course I am using for nearly 8 h  / day so maybe this is the difference)
for the pain I feel it many times a day (as if too much pressure) - but of course may be because I never wear my minus glasses

Actually during the first month the ocular muscles were squeezing the eye so when looking at anything far produced tears and pain.
Now is a bit better - but far from "relaxed".

For acuity it is very variable - sometimes I feel to be around -1D (for better eye) - so when driving with my correction (-1D) I can see prettyclearly than used to be. But especially at home sometimes I can see Snellen lines better and sometimes not even the biggest 20/200 - with the same light conditions  (due to eyes fatigue I think)

I think it is unreasonable to use high plus because eyes can streach only a bit to see 'better' so even when you wear +2D looking into distance - then it is blurry enough. I am not an expert so can't say if Rajaty got the floater because of too much plus, but is possible if you have the 'more pressure response' inside the eyes.

I was not trying more than +2D and rather for close work only. But when I read from computer (comparing to reading a book) I need to see quite clearly so +1.5D are forcing me to sit too close to the screen. +1D are fine for me for around 50-60cm distance.

Summing up: from what I understood you wear contacts, thus if you take them off the blur is similar to what you are going to do wearing plus on top.

Maybe high plus can help, as the response (in animal studies) was higher with higher plus - but there are always limits ...
I think this is not the method Tod advocates to put such stress.

« Last Edit: December 20, 2016, 02:31:25 PM by j23 »