Author Topic: Deconditioning Diet  (Read 8142 times)

Offline jared33

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Deconditioning Diet
« on: March 03, 2010, 06:57:54 AM »
I think this is pretty interesting.  It sounds similar to the ideas behind IF (intermittent fasting).  A lot of people have success on a program like fast-5:

 http://www.fast-5.com/.

They advocate that you keep your eating confined to a window of 5 hours every day, like 12 to 5 p.m., or  3 to 8 p.m.  So you are fasting 19 hours a day, which really helps the insulin get lower.  They have an e-book you can download and a users forum.

But I think what is different with the Deconditioning Diet is that you are avoiding regular patterns or expectations of eating.  So you are so to speak, confusing your eating psychology.  I think that is different.  

The idea of exposing yourself to food smells sounds a little weird, but it could work. I've heard that this works to help drug addicts avoid relapsing when they get around their old patterns. Not that that is the same as food cravings.

 I might try it.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 06:59:31 AM by jared33 »

Offline franklincaruso

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2010, 07:50:18 PM »
I've tried the deconditioning. I sometimes do it when I am hungry, and find it diminishes my appetite, oddly. The food smells can begin to smell more like chemicals, less like food.

Offline kt

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2010, 06:38:43 PM »
I tried deconditioning my reactions to the smell of fries, rotisserie chicken and steak.  It worked like a charm.  Sometimes I have to talk myself into eating - and nothing sounds good, even when I can smell the food at a restaurant!

Todd,

Dig the site!  Thanks for the FFA info on Seth's forum.  I'll probably wait until I'm no longer losing weight to get checked.

Kate

Offline Jbird

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #3 on: March 06, 2010, 01:48:24 PM »
I've been experimenting with different aspects of the Deconditioning Diet, which began with my trying various techniques associated with Seth Roberts' Shangri-La Diet. What started to "click" for me was learning about the role of insulin control in weight loss and management of hunger/appetite. I've been monitoring my blood glucose levels for about a week, which confirms what I suspected--that even so-called "good carbs" cause a spike in my blood sugar that leads to carb cravings and out-of-control eating, whereas lower-carb, higher fat meals don't seem to raise my blood sugar at all. The difference in what I'm seeing so far is really dramatic. Even though I'm not technically overweight, I've always had a lot of problems controlling my weight and appetite and having any structure in my eating patterns, so the freedom from obsession and self-torment I'm experiencing is really significant to me. Food doesn't even seem important, and it was always on my mind. I've only lost about 3.5 lbs. so far, from 132.4 to 129, but I'm happy to be making any progress at all. I'm 5'4.5" and am trying to get to 124.4, which would be a BMI of 21. I know people have succeeded from other methods, including the original Shangri-la techniques, but for me nothing seemed as effective as the concept of platinum calories (a high-fat, virtually no protein/carb snack or small breakfast) and low-carb eating, with well-spaced out meals eaten when my blood glucose readings are low (around 85 or lower). I won't be monitoring my blood glucose forever (or at least not this regularly), but I'm still in the process of figuring foods and combinations I can eat without causing a spike. I also feel I'll end up sticking with more of a paleo diet with occasional exceptions when I'm socializing, but for the most part I eat alone. I'm in the process of testing different meals so I can come up with a menu of options with a similar calorie count and ratio of carbs, fat, and protein. That will make putting meals together easier. Today I made a 400-calorie chef's salad with 1/2 oz of macadamia nuts thrown in that had about 12 g of net carbs, 22 g of fat, and 36 g of protein. An hour later my blood glucose was 79, so no spiking at all. I want to experiment to see what the upper limit of carbs per meal I can get away with. That's all I've had so far and it's about 4:30 and I will probably have a platinum calorie snack (coconut milk in hot tea) and skip dinner, but I'm getting together with friends later to watch a movie and may have a glass of wine and slice of cheese or some nuts, depending what they're serving as a snack. Normally I don't drink and I know that creates a spike in my blood sugar, but I'm not diabetic, so I think the occasional exception to my rules is a healthy thing. I don't want to be rigid and it's not my nature to be so. I just want a healthy, balanced life and overall sense of well-being, which I feel I'm achieving. I'm really grateful to Seth Roberts for encouraging self-experimenting and to all of my fellow lab rats on the Shangri-la forum, who have been so enlightening and encouraging, as well as information being presented here on "Getting Stronger." Looking forward to more active participation on this forum. Best of luck to everyone! Jaye

Offline jared33

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2010, 07:56:36 PM »
I tried deconditioning my reactions to the smell of fries, rotisserie chicken and steak.  It worked like a charm.  Sometimes I have to talk myself into eating - and nothing sounds good, even when I can smell the food at a restaurant!

Kate
kt, I am also finding that I am no longer responding as strongly to tempting food smells.  I've been skipping meals and reducing my cravings. And over the past week, I've lost about 3 pounds.

On Sunday, we had some friends over to cook dinner. I made some scrumptious home-made cheese and meat raviolis, followed by a really good prawn and scallop cioppino. And chocolate mousse for dessert.  It was very aromatic, and everyone loved it, but I didn't eat anything!  I made up an excuse that I had an upset stomach, which I really didn't.  I just wanted to see how this would work. I have to say that before trying this I would have never been able to resist eating that great food.  I did put a small leftover portion aside to eat yesterday, so at least I was able to enjoy it.  But I was able to choose when I would eat, rather than be driven by my appetite.

This is just really curious to me.  I would never have guessed I could change from someone who constantly thought about food to being able to go without.
« Last Edit: April 05, 2010, 09:09:59 PM by jared33 »

Offline franklincaruso

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2010, 07:04:21 PM »
I've begun buying 'torture foods'-- foods I would most want to eat. And I leave them out to look at, smell and touch. The first day I did this my appetite abated entirely, and I was able to fast for a longer period than usual.

You need stimuli to desensitize. So instead of avoiding the foods I crave most, I intentionally expose myself to them. It is empowering to feel mastery over donuts.

Usually I keep tempting food out of the house, so this is quite a different approach.

Be curious to hear if others try this, how it works for them...

Offline Moonbeam

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2010, 07:07:05 AM »
I've started experimenting with this.  It's the exact opposite of how I usually approach bad but yummy food.  So far so good, but it's going to get a lot harder for me soon because I have to go on a trip, which is my traditional time to forget all my diet rules.  Hopefully the super-stimuli of eating in restaurants but avoiding anything good will be extra deconditioning.

I think knowing that you are are making yourself not just mentally stronger but actually physiologically stronger is very inspiring, and I'm going to hold onto that thought.

Offline jared33

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2010, 01:58:03 PM »
Good luck with your experiment, Moonbeam. You are right that this is the exact opposite of the normal way of doing things, but believe me, it has been working for me. Actually I'm mostly past doing exposure to "torture foods" as franklincaruso calls them.  I did it alot the first week, and now it's down to once or twice a week.

The other thing that I'm seeing on this site that has worked for me is to make rules that you vow not to break. Having your own rules about what you will eat and when, what you'll skip, when to decondition, etc., makes things simple and keeps you from overthinking things. It's good not to make the rules too hard or inflexible, but you must have them, especially when you have stressful things like your trip that will try to throw you off balance. I see that Sugardude and others are making their own rules, and I found it helped me too.

I also agree with you that it is important to mentally praise yourself for sticking with this, because it will be hard for a while, but then it will get better. For me the cravings started to fade seriously after the first week, and I only get them on ocassion now.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2010, 02:31:00 PM by jared33 »

Offline Moonbeam

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2010, 05:51:32 PM »
I know you're right Jared; it's too hard to be absolutely perfect at all times.  I think doing the best we can in any given situation is a good goal. 

That's amazing that it worked for you so quickly.  The funny thing about it is that it may not really matter if it totally and physiologically gets rid of the cravings--as long as we remember that we "must strengthen ourselves" anytime we are confronted with temptation, we may be strong enough to resist.  Each temptation is a new opportunity.

(I did well on my first day.)




Offline Todd Becker

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2010, 07:22:36 PM »
Here is a new twist on deconditioning: A study shows mental rehearsal of eating suppresses appetite!

This reminds me of studies reported by Norman Doidge showing that mental rehearsal of piano playing and finger exercises were almost as effective as actualy piano practice in learning new music.

Perhaps, at the end of the day, all it takes to decondition appetite & cravings is to activate or rechannel the brain circuits themselves.

Offline Renfred

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2011, 11:03:15 PM »
I think this is pretty interesting.  It sounds similar to the ideas behind IF (intermittent fasting).  A lot of people have success on a program like fast-5:

 http://www.fast-5.com/.

They advocate that you keep your eating confined to a window of 5 hours every day, like 12 to 5 p.m., or  3 to 8 p.m.  So you are fasting 19 hours a day, which really helps the insulin get lower.  They have an e-book you can download and a users forum.

But I think what is different with the Deconditioning Diet is that you are avoiding regular patterns or expectations of eating.  So you are so to speak, confusing your eating psychology.  I think that is different.  

The idea of exposing yourself to food smells sounds a little weird, but it could work. I've heard that this works to help drug addicts avoid relapsing when they get around their old patterns. Not that that is the same as food cravings.

 I might try it.

Hi fellow, I think that some body who are not hunger bearer while saw some food they start eating at once and don't bear hunger allot. They don't bear the fasting of long interval's. What you say in this era......??

Offline stephenmarklay

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Re: Deconditioning Diet
« Reply #11 on: April 25, 2011, 05:02:50 AM »
I wonder if this type of deconditioning could be helpful to people that suffer OCD?  I have a friend that does so I will ask him to try it.


Here is a new twist on deconditioning: A study shows mental rehearsal of eating suppresses appetite!

This reminds me of studies reported by Norman Doidge showing that mental rehearsal of piano playing and finger exercises were almost as effective as actualy piano practice in learning new music.

Perhaps, at the end of the day, all it takes to decondition appetite & cravings is to activate or rechannel the brain circuits themselves.