Author Topic: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?  (Read 9791 times)

Offline saksham

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2013, 11:42:01 AM »
hi John,
from today my main focus is to only use the minus when it is necessary
whenever I will be indoors I won't be using any glasses only naked eye
I will use the plus glasses for 2 sessions of 20 minutes. a day
for reading and any other work I will be NAKED eye
and will read at the point of blur
I am also going to follow relaxation exercises  given by david de Angelis in his book which I will be receiving in upcoming 2-3 days

rightnow as I am typing I am naked eye and reading the words which are now blurred and I understand they are not at the point of blur because if I try to get them at the point of blur ihave to lean a lot
which pains me in my neck

Offline Steven

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2013, 11:59:02 AM »
hi John,
from today my main focus is to only use the minus when it is necessary
whenever I will be indoors I won't be using any glasses only naked eye
I will use the plus glasses for 2 sessions of 20 minutes. a day
for reading and any other work I will be NAKED eye
and will read at the point of blur
I am also going to follow relaxation exercises  given by david de Angelis in his book which I will be receiving in upcoming 2-3 days

rightnow as I am typing I am naked eye and reading the words which are now blurred and I understand they are not at the point of blur because if I try to get them at the point of blur ihave to lean a lot
which pains me in my neck


Very well.
I will start writing the guide and i will post it when it's finished.

Offline johnlink

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2013, 12:32:20 PM »
I will start writing the guide and i will post it when it's finished.

I look forward to reading it.

Offline saksham

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2013, 12:05:00 AM »
hello
wearing a +4 glasses and above on my naked eye
for 20 minutes and not staring can help me improve my eyesight .
 as you all know I have -6 myopia so wearing a +4 makes me a -10 myope.
 so will someone explain me how can  wearing a plus lens relax and reduce my eye's  prescription ??
I want to know how the plus that I will put on help  in reversing my myopia .
in short I want to know how plus lenses work

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2013, 05:14:50 AM »
Hi SakSham,
Subject: Many people giving advice - all reasonable.
As far as *I* am concerned, at every "sitting" you get an over-prescribed minus lens.  The OD is NOT concerned about long-term consequences TO YOU, when he does that.  He will not explain that a minus is, "poison glasses for children". In my opinion, he is PROFESSOINALLY OBLIGATED TO SAY THIS TO YOU - WHEN YOU ARE AT 20/40 TO 20/50.  I do not care about "money" - and a professional should not "care" about money either. He should just tell you objective scientific truth.  But he will not do that either.  I only argue that a plus COULD BE USED AT THAT POINT (and no minus) to slowly get out of 20/40 (change refractive STATE by +1.0 diopters in nine months).

The result of this "professional stone-walling" is that we have kids who get stair-case myopia from that FIRST over-prescribed minus lens - you got when you were 10 years old.  Today, you find out you were cheated - because of this stone-walling.  I regret that consequence, but we are all victims of this type of "office arrogance".  I can not "fight" these ODs in their office - since they think they are "perfect", and the rest of us are some "level" of stupid.  If we were TAUGHT to wear the plus at 20/40, we could get out of it - as Todd did.  But it take REAL commitment to wear the plus under your total control.  Since most people will refuse to wear the plus in that manner -  they simply lose more and more of their distant vision.

I "restrict" my prevention-advocacy to people who can still read the 20/60 line or so.  But you are "deeper" than that.  But I would strongly recommend you avoid wearing a -5.0 diopter for all your close work.  If you can read with no minus - get in the habit of doing so.  Get a Snellen chart and confirm your visual acuity. This will be difficult - but you can't know where you "stand" until you do so - in my opinion.



hello
wearing a +4 glasses and above on my naked eye
for 20 minutes and not staring can help me improve my eyesight .
 as you all know I have -6 myopia so wearing a +4 makes me a -10 myope.
 so will someone explain me how can  wearing a plus lens relax and reduce my eye's  prescription ??
I want to know how the plus that I will put on help  in reversing my myopia .
in short I want to know how plus lenses work


Offline OtisBrown

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2013, 05:46:11 AM »
Hi SakSham,

The OD in his office - is selling you extremely sharp vision - with a strong minus.  This is indeed, "shop practice" - not a profession.  You don't believe me - I am certain of that.  But here is an honest ophthalmologist who defines this problem in detail.

http://frauenfeldclinic.com/the-dirty-secret-of-your-optometrist/

I think this over-prescription is "eye killing" with that first minus and is totally tragic.  But at the same time, I agree that most people can not be persuaded to BEGIN the wearing of a plus when it can be most effective, i.e., they still read the 20/40 to 20/60 line.  But at least you know the truth as Alex tells it.

Offline johnlink

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2013, 06:24:26 AM »
hello
wearing a +4 glasses and above on my naked eye
for 20 minutes and not staring can help me improve my eyesight .
 as you all know I have -6 myopia so wearing a +4 makes me a -10 myope.
 so will someone explain me how can  wearing a plus lens relax and reduce my eye's  prescription ??
I want to know how the plus that I will put on help  in reversing my myopia .
in short I want to know how plus lenses work


I would say that it is not the use of plus lenses per se that reverse myopia. Instead it is using the eyes just inside and just outside the far point. When attempting to focus just outside the far point the brain has an incentive to both fully relax the ciliary muscles and also shorten the eye in order to eliminate the blur, which leads to a reduction in myopia

For someone with mild myopia of -1, the far point is 1 meter. If that person reads at 1/3 of a meter then he is doing a lot of contraction of the ciliary muscles in order to have the print in focus. A +2.0 lens would bring his far point to 1/(1+2) meters or 1/3 meter. He would then be reading at the far point.

For someone like yourself with -6 myopia, your far point is 1/6 of a meter, so there is NO NEED TO USE A PLUS LENS! Doing so would bring the far point even closer to you. In fact, YOU MIGHT ACTUALLY WANT TO USE A MINUS LENS FOR SOME ACTIVITIES! For example, if you computer monitor were 1/2 meter away, then -4.00 glasses would move your far point to 1/2 meter. You would then be able to see your monitor in focus but when you moved your head a little further away you would get a little blur which would be an incentive for your brain to reduce your myopia.

I hope it's becoming clear that the usefulness of a plus lens or a minus lens depends upon both 1) the current state of the person's vision, and 2) the activity for which the lens is to be used.

« Last Edit: March 17, 2013, 09:09:50 AM by johnlink »

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2013, 11:06:42 AM »
Hi John,

You are correct on all these points.  With a "strong prescription", the best you can do is to avoid wearing it, if possible, for close work.  You put a child into a strong minus - and you drive him DEEP into myopia.  I know that is never the INTENTION, but that is always what happens.  This is always due to our 1) Close work habits (not protected with a plus lens) and 2) Over-prescription of a minus lens - because no own will WARN YOU about number 1.

I regret these predictable consequences - but I can do nothing to persuade a person to BEGIN wearing the plus when we were at 20/40 or so.

Offline johnlink

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2013, 12:07:55 PM »
I can do nothing to persuade a person to BEGIN wearing the plus when we were at 20/40 or so.

I believe that if people understood the importance of using reading glasses and not distance glasses or contact lenses for close work then at least some of them, maybe many, would take the appropriate action. I think that I would have done so, but none optometrists ever told me the reasons why I must not use my contacts for extended periods of close work except when wearing a plus lens as well.

Offline peterg

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2013, 01:53:01 PM »
I believe that if people understood the importance of using reading glasses and not distance glasses or contact lenses for close work then at least some of them, maybe many, would take the appropriate action. I think that I would have done so, but none optometrists ever told me the reasons why I must not use my contacts for extended periods of close work except when wearing a plus lens as well.

Hi Johlink, wearing contacts ideally should be avoided. Frauenfeld speaks about them a few times in his forums. I think it would be difficult for an optometrist to advise contacts with plus lenses if they were looking at prevention as an ideal. The issue along with the distortion of multiple lenses which I already discussed, is the problem that for some more brief periods of near work you will inevitably be accomodating a large amount through the minus of the contacts.

However, if the person really wants contacts, buying bifocal contacts would probably be a better way in my opinion.  Thomas Aller is one proponent of bifocal contact lenses based on his testing with a pair of identical twins.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18601670

It is impressive that the one twin increased refractive error by -1.19D in the first year, while the other showed no progression (+.13D) in the first year, then a -.28D progression in the second year.

Offline johnlink

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Re: what are exactly STRONG PLUS LENSES?
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2013, 02:20:35 PM »

Hi Johlink, wearing contacts ideally should be avoided. Frauenfeld speaks about them a few times in his forums. I think it would be difficult for an optometrist to advise contacts with plus lenses if they were looking at prevention as an ideal. The issue along with the distortion of multiple lenses which I already discussed, is the problem that for some more brief periods of near work you will inevitably be accomodating a large amount through the minus of the contacts.

Well, there are trade-offs. Given that I'm currently about -3D myopic, I need either contacts or glasses for distance. While contacts are not easily removed for short periods of time, glasses do not allow the full field of vision afforded by contacts. So I have no interest in wearing glasses for distance, which includes riding my bike through the traffic of Manhattan. My contacts are very comfortable and using plus lenses in conjunction with them feels fine. I'm not at all concerned about accommodating a large amount for short periods of time, because I believe our eyes are fully capable of doing that, in fact probably thrive on the variation between looking near and far, and that we get in trouble only when we set our gaze at a fixed short distance for an extended period of time.

Quote
However, if the person really wants contacts, buying bifocal contacts would probably be a better way in my opinion.  Thomas Aller is one proponent of bifocal contact lenses based on his testing with a pair of identical twins.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18601670

It is impressive that the one twin increased refractive error by -1.19D in the first year, while the other showed no progression (+.13D) in the first year, then a -.28D progression in the second year.

I've considered bifocal contacts and have rejected them for the following reasons:

1) The additional time and cost of a fitting.

2) The additional cost of the lenses.

3) The possibility that fitting a toric bifocal contact for astigmatism might not work.

4) My expectation that I would not like the switching between the different portions of the lenses.

5) The setting of just one focal length for near, whereas using plus lenses over my contacts allows me to have one pair for reading (+3.0), another for computer work (+1.75), and yet another for watching TV (+0.50).

« Last Edit: March 16, 2013, 03:09:15 PM by johnlink »