Author Topic: My vision improvement so far.  (Read 5616 times)

Offline chris1213

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My vision improvement so far.
« on: August 28, 2013, 11:47:41 AM »
It's been 9 months since I started my 'journey', if you will, to recover my eyesight. I started with -2 in the right eye and -1.5 in the left one. Now I'm on -1 some days and -.075 other days. There might be a slight difference between both eyes because the left one sends a sharper image even though with the right one I see further between the blur. It's kinda difficult to explain but the point is that if I put a pair of -1 glasses I see the 20/20 line without any problem. Anyways, I admit to be kind of impatient. Eyesight is one of the most important, if not the most important of the five senses because we use our eyes all day long, we perceive the world mostly through them, we generally judge and take decision based on the image our eyes let us see, etc. And when the brain is not capturing a good quality image I experience some kind of withdrawal from the world, it's somehow depressing.

So today I took the decision to start from here, -1, the right way. I will use the steps I learned from Alex in the Frauenfeld clinic website and even if it takes time I'm willing to be patient. I must say I hate wearing glasses, I have to move my head to look at different things where as if I was able to wear contacts I would just move my eyes most of the time. But now that I know how contacts can affect our vision because it's hard to take them off every time we look at close distances, I guess I'll have to get used to the glasses for a while until I hopefully recover completely.

I'll be trying this for a couple of months to see if there is any progression. I have to figure out what I'm doing wrong or right so I can recover fully again. Your advice, opinions and/or suggestions are always welcome. I don't care if you want to tell me what to do, I take everything into account as long as I find it useful so feel free to reply.

I'll keep you updated.

Chris
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 “Everything is theoretically impossible, until it is done.” - Robert A. Heinlein.

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2013, 06:43:15 PM »
Hi Chris -

I would set a objectively defined "success" criteria for yourself.  Use objectively reading your Snelllen as the standard, supported by your use of a mild "test lens" to make your informed judgment.  Here are my definitions:

1) Functional vision, meaning objectively reading from between 20/40 to 20/60 on a brightly lit Snellen.  (A -1.5 would be required to "just clear" the 20/20 line -under your control

2) Driving vision (required of all of us).  Reading the 20/40 line (most of the letters), a -3/4 diopter will just clear the 20/20 line for us.

3)  When you exceed the 20/40 line - you are successful.  (Probably a -1/2 diopter will clear the 20/20 line for you.)

4) I think too many people want, "perfect" and then are disappointed when they do not get "perfect".  Success for me is recognizing that a certain amount of compromise is necessary.

5) I accept that this this work requires long-term (but pleasant ) wearing of a +1.5 to +2.0 diopters - during all the school years.  I know it is very hard to "accept" that challenge - but science suggests there is hardly any other choice.  One thing is certain - it does not involve a medical person is this process.

Yes - if it where me, I would ask the questions,
a) Is this necessary?
b) is this wise?
c) Have other people done this, at my age?
d) How long will it take to exceed the 20/40 line?
e) Will the results be permanent?

Some people seem to just "get the idea" and do it on a regular basis.  In a sense this is like a "long term diet", where you just re-start the diet when necessary.  But that is the true motivation issue - that only you can resolve.

Otis

Offline chris1213

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #2 on: August 28, 2013, 08:57:31 PM »
Thank you for your replies, I really appreciate it.

Tom Lu,

 I think you didn't understand. It's been 9 months since I improved from -2 to -1. I never wore contacts again, nor any minus lenses unless driving. Lately I just want to get back to 20/20, not getting a good quality image is stressing me a little bit so I'm thinking of wearing minus for a while, with an under correction though.

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Otis,

The questions you posted are exactly what I've thought about lately. I'm really glad to be -1 today, It's almost unbelievable that 9 months ago I had to wear -2 contact lenses. It's just my impatience, but now that you mentioned the example of the " long-term diet" I think you have made a huge point. Maybe this is like those last pounds or body fat one tries to get rid off. They're the hardest. It's just that I want to find that solution that will let me achieve 20/20. Right now I'm still on 20/40 - 20/50 depending on the days. I just sometimes want to see clearly again.

Anyways, I'll keep you updated and I'm still thankful for having found this procedure.

Chris

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2013, 03:36:09 AM »
Hi Chris -
Subject: Prevention with the plus is "daunting".

At some point you will have to convince yourself to wear the plus as a "habit".  That is truly difficult.  With "Bates" I always wonder if *anyone* was ever successful.  I do know that they "don't check their own Snellen chart".

I believe that science proves the need to "do it yourself".  Again I would stress the need to truly dedicate yourself to long-term plus wear.  Just to "find out" I would do it for the next six months - and then make the judgment.  Here is the commentary of my nephew - who started at age 14

Dear Uncle,          February 19, 1990

     Thank you very much for the book, "How to Avoid
Nearsightedness".  I got it yesterday after I came back from the
weekend.  I am looking forward to reading it soon, but for now I
have a great deal of school work to read.

     I would imagine you'll be pleased to have me tell you that
one of the first things I did after opening your book was to check
my eyes with the eye chart.  I am able to read the 20/20 line on
the eye-chart. I have been using my drug store plus lenses most
of the time now.  I have always passed the driver's license eye
test.

     I use these glasses nearly 100 percent of the time when I
read text books and use them for about 70 percent of the total
reading I do.  I started using them as much as possible again
because, at the end of last semester my sight was pretty bad (I
didn't check them on a chart).  I am lucky to have an uncle who
showed me back in eighth grade that I could prevent my
nearsightedness.

     One thing college has taught me is to listen to others and
then use or adapt methods to work for me.  In the last few years I
have had a great deal more reading work to do. If I don't use the
magnifying lenses I notice fairly quickly that my sight starts to
deteriorate.  Then I realize it's time to do something to stop
that process.

     At the moment, I am wearing the magnifying lens because I
know what it does for my vision.  Thanks for taking the time to
tell me how to avoid a situation, wearing glasses at all times for
the rest of my life, that I would find unpleasant, and for sending
me a copy of your book so I can learn more in-depth about the
methods I am using.

Keith
+++++

But even here - it is all "personal".  I did not "follow him around" and remind him to "wear the plus".  He realized that he had to do it himself.  There is no "final cure" - only the wisdom to follow the leadership of others, who are successful.

Otis

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2013, 09:10:36 AM »
Hi Tom and Chris,

I am not a "critic".  But one thing I refuse to do is to "claim" success beyond about 20/60 to 20/70.  Further, I define success with the person actually reading and exceeding the 20/40 line - at home.

I guess the word, "cure" is the difficult problem.  Most people think that "cure" means I do something "magic" for about two months -and then I am "cured" for life.  Tragically no evidence even suggest that that is possible.

Chris is old enough to make an "educated choice"  - an understand the consequences of his choice - one way or the other.  The good part is that he 1) Objectively checks his Snellen at 20/50, 2) Knows that a -1.0 D will clear the 20/20  line.

He could just easily do nothing for the next 4 years in college - and "hope for the best".  But from the Annapolis, I will tell him that is "wishful thinking".  With -1.0 diopters now, he can expect to pick up -2 dopters for a total of -3.0 diopters after four years, and some Graduate School.  At that point, he will be lucky if he can read the 20/200 line.  This not a "threat" - it is factual reality.

This is what my nephew Keith UNDERSTOOD - and acted upon.

But  I NEVER KNOW what any person will, or might do.

As I present it - prevention is indeed damn difficult.

Otis

Offline chris1213

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2013, 08:59:00 PM »
Otis,

Otis > Question - why are you wearing "minus glasses" at all?  (Except when absolutely necessary?)  The entire point of verifying 20/40 to 20/60 vision, is that your vision is good enough to avoid the minus.  Further, you just use a plus for all close work - staring with a "weaker" plus. < Otis
 
Answering your question, I haven't been wearing minus lenses at all. What I meant is that since I now know how contact lenses affect vision, I had thought of wearing a pair of under corrected spectacles (not contacts) to see far for a while as long as I wasn't print pulling. I am able to go by everyday without glasses but it's just that sometimes I just want to see very clearly again like before.

But despite the fact I thought about it I think I won't wear any glasses cause I just hate wearing any kind of stuff over my face. Plus I agree with you. If I can go by my day with no problem there is not really a reason to wear them. I think I just have to work on my patience for results haha.

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Besides that
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What I have done lately is wear either a +2 or +3 pair of lenses to pull focus for about an hour and half or two, and after I'm done I don't wear any kind of glasses at all. For a while I had been wearing a pair of +1 for all close work while I wasn't working on print pulling, just so over accommodation didn't take place. I stopped because for some reason I didn't ask the following questions on the forum. Now I understand I should, so I will.
 
Please give me your opinions or knowledge on the following:

- While one is not print pulling, should one wear a lower power plus lens for all close work? If yes, should one stay at the edge of blur while doing so or just wear a lower power lens and do all work regardless of the distance?

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I was also wearing a +0.5 lenses while indoors at home, with which I don't see perfectly but I do know what is happening around me. But I wasn't sure if I was doing the right thing. Should every time I wear plus lenses have to see clearly to make my eyes adapt or wearing plus lenses while not print pulling is useful just so over accommodation doesn't take place?

Chris

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #6 on: August 31, 2013, 03:38:40 PM »
Hi Chris -

You read the remarks of my nephew, Keith that I posted on the thread.

I am very pleased that you have improved by +1.0 diopters and are a -1.0 diopter now - and 20/40. That is indeed a success, considering your eyes go down if you do not wear the plus.

But equally, we all have a problem "convincing" ourselves to actually wear the plus in a disciplined manner.

That is the "real problem" with plus-prevention - we have a hard time convincing ourselves to do it. 

People are simply NOT predictable in what they might do - including wearing a +2.0 to +2.5 for all close work.  I respect you, of course, but like "weight control" most people recognize the need for it - and then they simply do not do it.

The reason I "restrict myself" to pilots (at 20/60) is because once they "get the idea", they just keep on doing it, given the need to pass the 20/20 line at home.  It is a matter of $$$$ for their chosen profession.  For a military pilots, it is indeed "either or".

I know "human nature", but very few people can truly keep up the long-term effort.  For people "deep" into myopia, they have to "swap" glasses to work on prevention.  With 20/40, you do not have to do that. Further, until you clear the 20/30 line, you can keep a -1.0 in your car.

In the final analysis - prevention is truly difficult - but you know HOW to do it, and the consequence of not doing it.  That is first-rate information.  Keep on posting your thoughts - it helps all of us.

Otis

Offline chris1213

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2013, 04:43:20 PM »
Hi Otis,

I appreciate and take into account every reply you give me. I actually tried to wear a -1 while outdoors but my eyes started tearing. I guess my eyes are more relaxed without any minus even though I can't see sharply from far. So yesterday I started wearing a +2 for all close work. My eyes were finally not stiff when I went to bed. Today everything was clearer, I was able to read the 20/40 and some of the 20/30 with no problem. It's now more clear to me how near work harm us without us even feeling it. I'm looking forward to wear the plus for all close work. Actually I do also wear them at college. I don't care if I kinda look weird wearing plus glasses, I rather wear them while I'm in class than wear glasses all the time. When I feel my eyes are getting uncomfortable I simply take the glasses off and look at the distance and my surrounding with my naked eye for a moment and then go back to the glasses.

I totally agree with what you say Otis. This is not magic, "I do this for two months and then I'm cured for life". This is a lifestyle. Just like people who think that if they go on a diet for a month or two they'll be thin for life some may think that wearing a plus for a while will just give them good vision for life. But I think it's all on the habits. The habit that I had of spending too much time on close work without any breaks damaged my vision, the good habit of wearing a plus, keeping a reasonable distance and engaging in outdoor activities has improved my vision. Our body will respond to the habits we have, either in a positive way or a negative one so I believe that the key is right there in our decisions.

Again thank you for the information Otis; for sharing your nephews experience, your own and your knowledge.

I'll keep you updated.

Chris

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2013, 06:41:38 AM »
Hi Chris -

Thanks for your review.

MOTIVATION:  When I post these remarks, I always wish *I* could have been no the "receiving" end of the advice.
This is why I posted the remarks of Keith, my nephew.  Keith knew that he had to do prevention by himself - for the "long-term".  Prevention is not a "cure", since our natural eyes "adapt" to long-term near, by going down at a rate of -1/2 diopter per year, for each year we are in college.

STANDARDS:  I believe in objective standards - applied to myself - that I can *personally* measure.  By that I mean I pass the 20/40 line.  I would expect to exceed the 20/40 line, in perhaps thee to four months.  That is the best indication that your steady wearing of a plus for all "near" is slowly having the desired effect.

CONVERSATION:  I enjoy the challenge of plus-prevention, and believe it is possible.  As you become more serious about your wearing of the plus - you will continue to have questions.  Please feel free to post them.  Our answers can not be "perfect" but they can help clarify some of these issues for you.

Thanks!
« Last Edit: September 01, 2013, 06:43:17 AM by OtisBrown »

Offline chris1213

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2013, 11:56:29 PM »
Here's a little bit more of my improvement and some discussion points.

So yesterday I did what I had read in Dr. Alex's program. For every (and I mean every) 20 minutes of close-up work I took 5 minutes looking into the distance (with some -0.5 glasses). I took a walk in the morning and a walk in the afternoon with no glasses. Then, 15 minutes in the evening with -1 glasses to see sharply. Today I went to a water park so most of the I spent it looking into the distance with no glasses, except when I was driving (for which I wore the -.05 glasses). However, tonight I had to go to Walmart to get some stuff and I thought I would wear the -1 glasses to see sharply. My surprise was that when I put the -1 glasses on they felt kinda strong. I stood up in front of the Snellen chart and the 20/20 line was very sharp I could almost make the 20/15. For a moment I thought I was wearing my -1.5 or -2 glasses cause it was too sharp. I'm very happy about this. Even though I know that my eyes' refractive status does not depend only upon the fact that I can see the 20/20 I know there was a benefit from what I did yesterday.

---- the rest of the post is not important, it's just a thought---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When I was driving back home, I could see that the stop lights and street signs didn't look perfectly sharp. They somehow looked double imaged. I missed the street where I had to turn right because from far away I couldn't tell it's name. However, when I made a u-turn and went back to the street, I looked at the sign and tried to figure out what it said. Suddenly the image became sharp again. The stop lights looked sharp too and this made me think. Eyesight should be automatic everyday right? So we shouldn't be focusing on everything around us to be able to see. Our eyes and brain should make the work. But what if we compare vision to walking? Walking is something that happens automatically; something you don't think about, you just set your destination and then walk. It didn't start like this though. We all had to learn to walk and our first steps where not automatic but after we learned how to walk they became so. Now, if someone suffers a severe foot injury, they must learn how to walk again and rehabilitate the muscles. Even if they did it for years, now they must relearn it. So I think this might be also true for eyesight. It's about relearning how to see and use our eyes. I keep my word to the fact that habits have mostly to do with it but we have to construct this habits for them to become unconscious. What do you think about it?

Offline Todd Becker

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2013, 11:38:32 AM »
My surprise was that when I put the -1 glasses on they felt kinda strong. I stood up in front of the Snellen chart and the 20/20 line was very sharp I could almost make the 20/15. For a moment I thought I was wearing my -1.5 or -2 glasses cause it was too sharp. I'm very happy about this.

Great results, Chris.

When I was driving back home, I could see that the stop lights and street signs didn't look perfectly sharp. They somehow looked double imaged.

Double images, in this context, are a sign that your eyes are remodeling to become less myopic.  This is a consequence of multiple layers of the retina coming into differential focus.  I've written about this at several places in the forum...do a search on "double image".

Eyesight should be automatic everyday right? So we shouldn't be focusing on everything around us to be able to see. Our eyes and brain should make the work... It's about relearning how to see and use our eyes....Now, if someone suffers a severe foot injury, they must learn how to walk again and rehabilitate the muscles. Even if they did it for years, now they must relearn it. So I think this might be also true for eyesight....we have to construct these habits for them to become unconscious. What do you think about it?

I think you are right that a "deconditioned" eye may take some time to retrain its focal habits.  You analogy with muscular retraining of an injured foot is apt.

Todd
« Last Edit: September 09, 2013, 11:42:49 AM by Todd Becker »

Offline Hillyman

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2013, 02:59:51 PM »
I think you are right that a "deconditioned" eye may take some time to retrain its focal habits. 

Todd

I am making some progress using the print pushing. I practice this even in the shower in the morning, using the print on the shampoo bottle... It's interesting that when I first look at the bottle, it seems blurred but if I wait and "relax" into it, the print comes up much more clear. It seems my eyes are deconditioned, as you say, and needs a nudge to get the focus systems working! I make a point of going without my glasses as much as possible in the morning and even on the commute by train until I have to put them on at the office.

Offline chris1213

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2013, 07:49:31 PM »
I was wondering while doing my exercises. If I only have a pair of +1 available is it the same to increase the distance beyond 50cm/20in with a +1 and using a +2 at a shorter distance? I mean, can wearing a +1 at 75 cm create the same stimulus as wearing a +2 at 40cm??

Offline OtisBrown

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2013, 04:56:06 AM »
Dear Chris -

What you think is indeed very important.  It is how we "internalize" a solution that can lead to personal success.  Let me add that even people with 20/20 vision, have some "problem" with distant objects  - and that is normal.  Of course a very mild minus (0.5 diopters) will "clear" that last diopter.  I would again concentrate on the 20/20 line on your home Snellen - to avoid wearing the minus lens (except for driving).  My question (that I would struggle with), is to ask "WHY is it wise, and totally necessary to "wear a plus for near".  For me, that is the "right answer", but most people indeed get "tired" of that type of self-discipline, and will quit wearing it.  Believe me - I asked all your "questions", and have my own answers.  So let me respond - as best I can.

Chris> ---- the rest of the post is not important, it's just a thought--------

When I was driving back home, I could see that the stop lights and street signs didn't look perfectly sharp. They somehow looked double imaged.

Otis> This is indeed typical when the normal eye has slight negative status.  I would not be worried about it.  You are looking for a change of about +3/4 diopters.  From my experience and long-term exposure, wearing the plus in a very consistent manner, will create a change of that amount in about six to nine months.  This will be confirmed, objectively by you, by reading your Snellen.  I think you will "get there", but the continued self-discipline is indeed difficult - until you understand the consequences if you do not continue to do it.

 I missed the street where I had to turn right because from far away I couldn't tell it's name. However, when I made a u-turn and went back to the street, I looked at the sign and tried to figure out what it said. Suddenly the image became sharp again. The stop lights looked sharp too and this made me think.

Otis> You Snellen (brightly lit) must be your scientific measurement.  You know how to MEASURE your refractive state, and check with a mild minus lens.  That puts YOU in full control of this preventive process.  What you should know, is that is is "automatic" thaty your vision goes down through four years of college - because of all that close work.

Eyesight should be automatic everyday right? So we shouldn't be focusing on everything around us to be able to see. Our eyes and brain should make the work.

Otis>  I agree - up to a limit.  But the experimental reality is this - you put all normal eyes in a "long-term near", and they change their "status" from plus to minus.  If plus - you have 20/20 vision.  If minus, you will have 20/30 to 20/50 vision.  This is what we are doing to our eyes, and correctly understood, we must get "rid of the near".  The only practical way to do this - it the discipline of putting that plus on as a habit.

But what if we compare vision to walking? Walking is something that happens automatically; something you don't think about, you just set your destination and then walk. It didn't start like this though. We all had to learn to walk and our first steps where not automatic but after we learned how to walk they became so. Now, if someone suffers a severe foot injury, they must learn how to walk again and rehabilitate the muscles. Even if they did it for years, now they must relearn it. So I think this might be also true for eyesight. It's about relearning how to see and use our eyes.

Chris> I keep my word to the fact that habits have mostly to do with it but we have to construct this habits for them to become unconscious. What do you think about it?

Otis>  I think the "habits", that we are forced to accept (long-term near work) creates negative status for our totally natural eyes.  I know it is difficult to "think that way", but a massive amount of science and fact support it.

Otis> To take "systematic" personal control, and wear the plus - is truly difficult for almost everyone.  I personally accept that challenge.  But only you alone can convince yourself to do what is necessary.

Otis> Most people I simply do not know.  I do not know what they are doing in their life.  I know people to be intelligent, but even so, they lack MOTIVATION to do what is so obviously necessary (to me).

Otis> Only the fact that you are entering a 4 year college, allows me to tell you that your refractive state will go down by -2.0 diopters in four years.  That is advance knowledge of what will happen, if you neglect to wear the plus during those four years.  For me, that is indeed objective knowledge, not a "threat" that if you don't wear the plus - that is what is going to happen. 

Otis> That is what convinces me - to wear the plus.  This is not a "medical argument", but a scientific common sense argument.



Offline chris1213

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Re: My vision improvement so far.
« Reply #14 on: October 08, 2013, 02:18:36 PM »
Otis, I must say I appreciate the time you take to completely answer my questions and doubts. Thank you very much. It's indeed difficult at some extent to stick to wearing the plus. However, my problem is not wearing the plus but the impatience I get sometimes of just wanting to get back my vision again. Anyways, I'm till here exercising my eyes bringing the stimulus they need to change positively.

I was wondering something though. I read in some post from Shadowfoot where he said that, according to Todd, wearing a +2.5 was equivalent to looking far into the distance. Did he mean that wearing a+2.5 at 50 cm is the same as looking meters and meters away? Or what's special about the +2.5 compared to the other plus lenses?

Chris